Who Would Watch This?

Who Would Watch 'A Bug's Life'?

• Season 6 • Episode 35

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0:00 | 1:05:26

Oscar and Carl continue “VS Month” and set their sights on the Pixar classic A Bug's Life.

A Bug’s Life follows Flik as he tries to recruit a bug PMC to help defeat the invaders. We follow along as they attempt to weaponize fear against the enemy. Not only are we trying to figure out who would watch this, but also whether this or Antz is better.

It’s A Bug’s Life… but why! That’s the hour.



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SPEAKER_00

My name is Oscar. My name is Carl. And this is Who Would Watch This?

SPEAKER_01

Welcome to Who Would Watch This, the podcast where we watch a film, we chat about the film, and then we try and figure out who would watch this.

SPEAKER_00

Today we're talking about a bug's life, which currently has a 7.2 on IMDB, a 92% on Rotten Tomatoes, and a 3.5 on Letterboxd.

SPEAKER_01

Oscar, what's the plot? I like you said only has a seven. Like you were just like a bunch of people have been hyping up this nonsense. Um, a misfit ant looking for warriors to save his colony from greedy grasshoppers, recruits a group of bugs that turn out to be an inept circus troop. Wow, bloody wee, Carl. Wow.

SPEAKER_00

That sounds like a comedy for the ages. People have been saying that. That's the most 1998 plot I've ever heard. That exactly.

SPEAKER_01

They really nailed the time, you know. It really was the late 90s. I was two when this came out. Oh my god, alright.

SPEAKER_00

Isn't that fun for all?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I was one. So, you know, I'm full of youth. Carl, before we, you know, chat about Bugs Life and discuss ants. Should we go to last week before we'd seen the other half? Oh, when we were trying to predict who we thought would watch this. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I think we should go back to the page. We should play the ape. Carl, a bug's life. Have you seen it? Have you felt it? Um, what's your feeling? How are you feeling right now? You look okay. You look good. Look good. This this works. This works. I'm getting by.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

That's the look that's on your face right now. Guy getting by. I'm tired.

SPEAKER_00

I'm tired. I'm a grown man trying to looking at looking at watching a bug's life this week.

SPEAKER_01

It's a tough, it's a tough life to live. It's funny if looking for a calendar being like, I don't know, doctor's appointment, should I, you know, get a colonoscopy? Oh, there's bugs life. Bugs life, get my prostate checks, you know, cry. I've got to schedule my cries. Well, the one where you shit in a box and send in the mail. That is a thing you have to do. There's a thing at I'm shaking my head. No, you shouldn't shake your head. Guys, get checked for whatever that is, or just start shitting in boxes and send it through the mail. You know, you guys do you.

SPEAKER_00

It's it it should find its pla it should find its way to the right place. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

You don't even need to address it. The post office is like big bag of poop, you know, send it out to the medical.

SPEAKER_00

They're like, oh, add it to that pile over there. We'll we find it at home. It gets to where it needs to be. Oh, the post, huh? Yeah, or the post. Look, um, a bug's life. Um, not one of my favorite Pixar films. I reckon conservatively I've seen this like three times in my life. Uh Young, have you seen it recently? No, I have not seen this in. Gotcha.

SPEAKER_01

So you at like 10 was just like, if not for me. You know, and I guess you were I guess I guess you did have Toy Story 1, 2, up Incredibles. Yeah. Maybe a Wally. I think by the time if I remember Nemo.

SPEAKER_00

I'm trying to remember going to the movies for Pixar, like actually going to the cinema. I remember seeing Incredibles. That's probably the earliest Pixar movie I can remember going to. Yeah. Um, and so I think by the time my parents were like giving me Pixar movies on DVD and VCR and renting them for me, and a Bugs Life popped up. I think I f didn't like the animation.

SPEAKER_01

Gotcha. Bit too dated. Yeah. Because I feel like they kept updating the Toy Story one. They were like, this is good. Yeah. We nailed it first go. And Bugs Life thought, it's fine, we'll leave it there. It's fine. You guys can, it's janky, but we'll leave it there.

SPEAKER_00

I don't think I ever really gelled with it. And then on top of that, I don't think I ever particularly found it a very engrossing.

SPEAKER_01

You didn't connect to Flick, the Inventor.

unknown

Oh god.

SPEAKER_00

I couldn't tell you.

SPEAKER_01

You didn't even connect to their struggles, you know.

SPEAKER_00

See, even you saying the inventor, that's I don't know what you're on about. You know, like uh from in my memory, the story of a bug's life is there's an ant, yeah, um, and then a circus comes to town, and they're they're con artists and stuff, and then Kevin Spacey's uh a grasshopper. Giving a performance, yeah. Um, and I think the uh the grasshoppers are villains, and then the circus helps out. Yeah. Uh and you've nailed the plot.

SPEAKER_01

I will say in recent years, I feel like um, I don't know, with everything that's going on in the world, for some reason everyone was like, you know what, that ant monologue uh from a bug's life really popped off for a hot minute. There was like a TikTok with like two million like likes. Just like pretty much like, you know, we're a group of ants and we can stand up to the 1%, and everyone's just like that goes hard.

SPEAKER_00

Like a good eat the rich moment for the ants. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Goody the rich moment. Yeah, I couldn't, yeah. So I don't really have much of a memory or something.

SPEAKER_01

We're not here to just discuss uh bugs live, we're here to compare the ants and a bug's life. I feel like a lot of people uh have uh essentially whatever their childhood opinion was, whatever one they had at home, and they're like, that's the better one. So I'm keen to figure out what.

SPEAKER_00

I know again, to for if you didn't listen to the ants episode, I was staunchly an ants kid. Yeah. So I didn't not that I think I realized there was a bugs life boy. Oh, Bugs Life Boy, you know? Yeah, and you know, there's a reason there's a reason that there's always been a distance between the two of us as hosts, is and this is this is the hole between us that needs to be filled.

SPEAKER_01

And like I'd love to fill it, but and yes, just a big pile of dead ants might not do the trick. Yeah, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_00

Also, the thing is the you know, uh ants didn't live up to the hype.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

People have people have been saying that.

SPEAKER_01

Isn't it crazy you go down the metacritic, go, I'm only watching films with 96% run to Marcus 4. And ants just did not live up to the hype.

SPEAKER_00

Well, that's the thing about ants, it is very good.

SPEAKER_01

Ants is a very good film. I also I feel like I edited the last episode and we we came up the gate with no information. So I have gone out and reached reached out and like figured out what the hell uh the whole thing was. Essentially, um, is it John Ratzenberg and uh what's the John Lassider? John Lassider. Uh what's it called? Michael Eisner, he works at Disney, he's a CEO. Uh the guy who's like, hey, I'm kind of nailing it, made Beaut and the Beast, made Sleep uh made uh finally the Little Mermaid one. Yeah. All that stuff. He's like, I want to be like CEO. He's like, uh no, fuck off. So he goes off, makes DreamWorks. Yeah. He's making this whole uh ant thing, and then uh but Pixar has this idea. So they make Toy Story and then immediately start work on Bugs Life, he takes that idea, and then it's just this spike thing where they're both trying to pretty much rush the ants uh production. So then you just get this film both films are just quite uh quickly shodily together. But at one point, uh there was only three fully animated films for kids, and two of them were ants. Isn't that fun? What was the other one? Oh Toy Story, yeah. Did they come out the same year? They came out the same month one month apart. Really? How dumb is honestly that's the fun of them. Both essentially, because DreamOoks only had so uh Pixar had two years extra on them. Yeah, okay. So they pretty much fast forwarded this so quickly. And I think you can tell an ant, so I'm keen to see in Bugs Life if they've got more fleshed out ideas and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_00

Well, yeah, I mean, I haven't watched a really early Pixar film in a long time. Yeah, so I am really excited to.

SPEAKER_01

I feel like even Tillway Story 2 is like because I think it's they've remastered it, but they have not done it for this one. So I'm keen to see all the time.

SPEAKER_00

Wow. A Bugs Life really won at the box office, hey. It was, yeah, it's 363 million to 171 million. Yeah. But that's what happens when you go violent. Yeah. And and that that's the thing as well. Ants is very good. It's not for me. It's just not for me, but it is very good. It's very good.

SPEAKER_01

I like you're a toothless critic. That's just like I look, I don't want to come.

SPEAKER_00

I can acknowledge it's good. Yeah. Absolutely acknowledge it's good. It's not for me. It's just not for me. It's just not for me. Uh so Carl, who would watch a Bugs Life? Um, I guess if you didn't like ants, you're probably gonna really like a bug.

SPEAKER_01

So essentially they spitefully uh pushed it forward in over two months. Um, but I love walking out of a bug's life being like, you know what, that just wasn't for me. Maybe I'll go back and be burnt once again. Someone got burnt twice with two ant animated films in one in one month. What a horrible life that would have been, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Uh what about you? Who do you reckon's gonna watch a bug's life? What's your relationship to a bug's life?

SPEAKER_01

Uh I loved it as a child. I watched it a lot as a kid. Yeah. Um, and I guess who would watch us? I guess lovers, poets, um, you know, people that sort of respect themselves.

SPEAKER_00

Do you have a favorite Pixar film? Um I think I'm excited because we've we very rarely one do, I guess, well-reviewed movies on the podcast, and two, uh Pixar is obviously a huge part of millennials. So I was like, let's open up the conversation though. Do you have a favorite Pixar film?

SPEAKER_01

I guess, I guess, like in my older age, I guess the one that you can kind of go back to is Rad Touille. That's kind of the one that I mean, and maybe not as a kid. I wasn't like a lovers French cuisine, but I feel like it's the one that probably stands the test of time uh I feel like I love a Toy Story too, you know? Yeah. That's probably that's my childhood one, and I feel like I'm gonna re-watch. I'm like, that's a great sequel, you know. Um in recent years, I can't, I think probably Inside Out is probably the last one that I'm like fully connected to. I haven't still still still seen Soul, but maybe that was the one that's I've heard that's the inside Lou and Davis for children, which I thought was just a crazy like, whoa. I love that picture. We've got to make kids film, but then a bunch of 40 fucking year olds are still like, is it for me? Like, yeah, he's a sad guy, didn't nail it in like this one's uh this one's about jazz. Kids love jazz. Yeah, they're like, hey, you old fucking foodies, go check out this one, you're freaks. Um, I haven't seen, yeah, I don't know. I didn't like the all the kiddie ones. I'm not gonna be the one.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I find that there's like a kiddie quality to them now, and I think the last one that didn't have it was Sol. I think that the two that I I really I think I did in the end reflect pretty positively on Luca. I think that was a nice one, just because I think I like the setting of like Seaside Italy. I think that was really nicely animated.

SPEAKER_01

And again, we're just we're we're getting the bits that are for adults. I'm like, oh, wouldn't it be nice to be in Italy right now? Yeah, I know. I was like, this is like an animated travel vlog. It's hard to like have the same. I feel like people like, you know, I get love our Pixar, but now they're not for us, you know? And I don't think that's a that's not a bad thing.

SPEAKER_00

No, not at all. I think the issue is is that well, not that it is like an issue, but like you know, you watch something like an Across the Spider-Verse and you go, animated movies can still be for kids and adults. Yeah. Like in a really, really strong way. Yeah. So I don't know why Pixar I think is flopped in this other direction, because I'm really sick of its animation style that it's chosen to do for a lot of its movies.

SPEAKER_01

It's not illumination style, it's like it's the uh I call it bean mouth. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

It's the uh turning red, the Lucas, the the sort of because then you get ones like um when they have to do pre-established animation like a Toy Story, like the humans in Toy Story don't look anything like the humans in Turning Red. Yeah. Um I go, wow, this is much nicer. I way I way more prefer this. And so I don't know why they're so intent on doing it.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I guess they just I I guess they must just know that's the style that uh kids are connecting to. And at a certain point Well they because Pixar's not doing great anymore. No, I think they're because I think they're following illumination. Illuminations have gone for that sort of similar style, that sort of simplistic one, and then I think they've gone, that's just how the industry's going. Ooh, want to make a kids film. Like the kids aren't being like, oh, the legacy of Pixar. Like, what do they really do? No, I know. They know.

SPEAKER_00

I'm really excited for Netflix's Bride Bird's new film. Cool. Do you know this called Ray Gun? And it's like a it's uh set in the future, but it's like 60s or 50s aesthetic, and it's a neo-noir thriller. Great, and uh like sick.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I know I was like, this is all I was like, this sounds great. Oh my god. I mean, I love Iron Giant. I think he did that as well. But he also did the Incredibles and that whole like that vibe, that futurism. I can't remember what it's called, that style works. That was great. So cool, funky. Um, but a bug's life, where are you who who's a floor? Look, uh yeah, wise people, I think.

SPEAKER_00

I'm keen why did it resonate with you going off of memory? When was the last time you were?

SPEAKER_01

I think I liked Flick. I think I liked that he was a bit of a frickin' outsider. I feel like, you know, at me at six, I was like, you know, I'm always inventing. I made a lot of things. You know, I was the first one to make the iPhone, and guess what? Steve Jobs took that out of my hands and said, spit on my face. But you know, I was an outsider, you know, people did not like that when I Blackberry hated it. You're meant to stay in line. Yeah, 2005 was a not a kind year for me. But but um yeah, I'm I feel like I feel like I'm gonna honestly get out of this. I feel like it's gonna be a pretty basic story. I think it's gonna be like three jokes and go, it's pretty good, and that's about it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

You know, I think when you look at all the Pixar stuff, you're like, okay, it's probably like lower than cars, you know. Yeah. Which is um, yeah, crazy.

SPEAKER_00

I'm interested to see if it can because my memories I didn't like a bug's life very much. And we've just watched dance and I didn't like that. So it's like, what's but in the end here, what if I just lose twice?

SPEAKER_01

It's funny that there was one guy in 1998 that has gonna have the exact same experiences you're about to have of watching two ants films and going, I didn't like either, and I spent a lot of money on them, huh?

SPEAKER_00

It looks like there's about$500 million at the box office in relation to ant animated movies, and everyone lost.

SPEAKER_01

It's crazy they burnt the ant well so quickly. So not another ant thing's come out since, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Uh what about Epic? Huh? Remember DreamWorks. You know what?

SPEAKER_01

Actually, for a hot minute, there was a bit with the Epic. What if things were small in the grass? And I think they went, we can do it. And they went, You know what?

SPEAKER_00

I don't think people like things that are small. Because I don't think anyone even really likes Ant Man. And I don't think they've ever been able to get people to connect with like what if things were small?

SPEAKER_01

Which is a shame because I think everyone on paper goes, I would love to be like down in the grass. And you go, Oh, that it. It's kind of filthy down there. Yeah, kind of disgusting. Kind of dirty. Yeah. Rose. Disgusting.

SPEAKER_00

Fucking yuck. Yuck. Oscar a bugs life. Let's let's get it off the bat. Man, how much better has the Pixar logo gotten?

SPEAKER_01

Oh, oh, oh, what do you mean? Just the the the lamp?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I was like, it looks much nicer now. Seeing it like not redone. I don't know what version you sort of saw. I saw on Dis I saw on Disney Plus, too. Have they redone the beginning, do you reckon?

SPEAKER_01

I don't think so, because it was the I remember there was nostalgic because the Disney class with just the blue background and then the lamp that was jank. I was enjoying the jank because I feel like they've smoothed out every polygon now. So it was fun seeing like a fly's eye, and they were like, no, we just it's it's 18 polygons. Which was quite endearing, you know. They were like, we nailed water. It's like, what about something else? They're like, no, no, no, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_00

That's it. I do think that there is you can see in comparison to ants, this Pixar is showing off having better animation. They I could stage they're like, we're gonna do fire because we can. And you go, Yep, you can. They can.

SPEAKER_01

At one point, I remember at the end of the film, there's just a bit where they're just like, here's the screensavers of the of the film, and my partner was like, What the fuck are they doing here? And I was just like, they're flexing. See that piece of grass? Just just cuz. It's just cuz. Let's get into it. I do think, just comparing him, ants feels like a first draft that they then are made into a film, and this feels like they've they've re-wittled it down to essentially what they want to do. That's how I feel. Because I think that's literally what the production was.

SPEAKER_00

This is there is clearly an element of Pixar, like already, where you go, this is this is operating on a on a better field. Of just like things are paying off, better characterizations. Pixar's definitely, you can see it's getting the magic. I have not watched such an early Pixar film in a long time. It was really fun to watch them watch them be like, you're standing up, but you're not running yet. Yeah. You know, but I can see that you are doing a lot, like you're doing way better than what Dreamworks are.

SPEAKER_01

I think that circus troop they have, they're really like, they're like, ooh, half of these characters are great, other half pretty pretty forgetful. Yeah, that's fine.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I mean I just in terms of like I the Yeah, I think the movie's really quick to get going, which is something Ants was very slow at doing.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. I think like, look, like it really is just like a first draft, like 19th draft. Like the pacing is every scene's flowing into the next one. It doesn't feel that long. Ants drags incredibly, yeah. It feels like they've got like five in big sequence, whereas Bugs Life feels like it just ble bleeds in like 12. It's supposed to be a big one.

SPEAKER_00

Well the the issue, the differences as well, is because ants is probably more akin to say a saving private Ryan. You know, a Bugs Life is more like a bubblegum movie. So, you know, they're they're going for different things. What's a bubblegum movie? Yeah, no, it's just selling you chew on the flavor goes away and you spit it out, you know. Whereas ants was very ants was ants had grit.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, like a Spielberg epic, you know. That's what people would think. That's what I'd compare it to. Yeah. This is really the shinless list of ants, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

The thing that's great about the movie Ants with a Zed is the fact that there are a lot of ants. Watching a Bug's life, I didn't get the feeling there were a lot of ants. Gotcha, okay. So you think the colony was lacking, you know? Yeah, if I had to say, like, look, I think already we're like a couple minutes into the movie, I'm going, wow, a bug's life is is winning pretty quickly, but uh there's not a lot of ants.

SPEAKER_01

Dare I say ants has sequences where there's straight lines of maybe a thousand ants. Yeah. Bugs Life probably has, I don't know, a hundred people standing around.

SPEAKER_00

And you're like, it's not a lot of ants.

SPEAKER_01

Look, it is it's a hundred ants, granted.

SPEAKER_00

But then I then again later there's like a way more ants, and you go, Well, where are all the ants? Like, because the I think the numbers keep going up and down.

SPEAKER_01

I think that that's ants, you know. They're doing other things, you know.

SPEAKER_00

And that's the thing. Not to me. I love that they did not want to show tunneling in this movie. They were like, they were like, that's a weird thing to even bother to show. We're not even gonna do it. Ants is doing that? Oh, that movie's in the grave already.

SPEAKER_01

Oh my god. They were like, what if we did New York? Isn't it funny that both and again I feel like constantly people are stealing? It's like the cold war for Pixar and Dreamworks because they're all just stealing ideas. There's another New York sequence in this one, because I was like, they were like, not the tunnels, but what if the circus guys were in New York?

SPEAKER_00

I think I love a Pixar movie. Now, like in retrospect, you're seeing this movie, and you can go, oh, like Pixar's getting into the groove of this is the life of like a car or a bug or a fish, and this is how it operates, and this is their Madison Square Garden, and this is what a vehicle is to them. And it's like, do I really give a shit? And I think the movies that I love, I love here's the thing.

SPEAKER_01

I feel like immediately they go, you know what? I don't think it's interesting. Because honestly, that cars too, I feel like goes, what if uh what if you saw Spain in the car's land? You're like, this breaks a lot of boundaries, you know. I feel like Shark Tale has the issue of like it's it's New York. No, they just love sucking off New York, don't they? Jesus Christ. Finding Nima doesn't do that.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, I think I think they were I think Pixar works out that the better thing to do is set up the world and put them on an adventure. Yeah. What something that blew my mind when watching A Bugs Life is I didn't re I when it was beginning, I was like, oh I forgot he must go on a long adventure and just comes back with the troop at the end. But he brings the troop back within half an hour. He doesn't have an adventure. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So I think the and then we're spoiled with, and I know you compared it to Shindler's list, but uh you did that. No, no, no. Saving Private Ryan, I will say, in terms of action, wow, we're spoiled. We get 45 minutes of plot and then 45 minutes of some of the most intense action sequences. You're talking about ants? Talking about your bugs life. You're talking to an ants over there? Don't put Z's in my mouth. Don't put ants with Z in my mouth, okay? I don't want them. I don't fucking want them. Okay, things I'm loving. One, the apostrophe in the bug's life is a little bug. Isn't that clever? It's very good. It's very good. I agree. I fully agree. Yeah, look, it's probably the best logo I've seen for a film ever. I can't believe they they blew their load as quickly with the font. You know, I'm just thinking, like, what's Toy Story got? What's Rad Twee got?

SPEAKER_00

It was one of those things where I when when a bug's life came up in font, I was like, ah, they've got ants beat. I was like, they've done it pretty quick. Ants had a weird letter in it, you know. These guys have got the boss they have more going on. I could say as well, straight off the bat, like when we were watching ants, I was like, God, this is a fucking drab looking movie. Bugs Life, they're like green. All the ants are blue. They were like color white.

SPEAKER_01

We're gonna be outside for most of it. Yeah. And quite frankly, greenery. And the ants are all blue and they look. I don't, I don't, yeah, they don't look exactly like ants, but I but they're so smart to give them characterizations and hats.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

So smart to give them hats. Like this one gets a hat. This one's old, and this one's got yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

They were smart as well to go, we don't need to see the queen just squirting out kids. We don't have to give a realistic approach to how an ants colony.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, you can kind of vibe out that they're all siblings and brothers. I don't want to see squirting out lava, you know.

SPEAKER_00

I think because when I was watching ants, I was like, man, the life of a queen is sad.

SPEAKER_01

Um whereas this one, pretty good, pretty good. That's a classic royalty. They also get to wings. Yeah, I didn't realize Ann's following.

SPEAKER_00

I mean, they both have a princess.

SPEAKER_01

There was a thing where I both fawning over the princess, yeah. And I but one's in Seinfeld, so it was funner.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so who is Flick?

SPEAKER_01

He's just like a Pixar uh uh animated producer sort of vibe, and they're like, we like your voice, Click, but you're gonna be able to do it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, because I was surprised he wasn't a name when I was looking him up.

SPEAKER_01

Because everyone else has got a name. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um it's it's a pretty star-studding cast all the time. Um and I will say as well, a much better cast film than Ants. I think the the the voice acting really just falls into the characters in a fantastic way. Who's the ladybug? Is that Christian Slater?

SPEAKER_01

No, no, it's uh it's not Dennis Leary. Is it Dennis Leary? He's Diego in um Isaiah. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Fantastic.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Like really suits the characterization. Like I don't think Dreamworks got the memo on how to do voice acting for a while. Because they're they're always higher. It takes them a while. They're always like, I feel like Shark Tale is pretty bad. Maybe like Odi, like Jack Black's well casted and that. All the rest are just like, oh, this is great. Yeah, I think. But they're all A-list, as well.

SPEAKER_00

I do think I like Kung Fu, like I think Kung Fu Panda gets good because I think Dustin Hoffman's well cast and that. I think whoever does the turtle's really good. Like obviously the th like the the famous five of them, I think, are all ringing celebrities that don't disappear. But the core members I think work in Kung Fu Panda is like OC. Ian McShane is the villain, I think, is excellent.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, all those villains are pretty good. I think slow. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I think they're really slow to I think Pixar really works out what to do pretty quickly.

SPEAKER_01

I feel like they're great of just getting like it just feels like they're honestly Pixar's a bunch of nerds and they're all like alt comedy because they just constantly get like uh Julia Louise Dreyfus. I feel like Like, what's the guy's name uh who plays like uh Kevin Spacey's brother? He's so funny. He's on John Mullaney Live.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, um Richard Kind. Yeah, Richard Kind. He's really good excellent. Toy Story 2 also does a introducing kids to Richard Kind. Yeah, what a choice. It must have been wild back in the time being like, oh, I can be like a comedian and Pixar's interested in casting because I've got a weird, weird mannerisms to my voice.

SPEAKER_01

Yes. But constantly Pixar did that, you know. They've done the I mean Larry the cable guy, like unfortunately is great casting.

SPEAKER_00

I think Pat Noswald's incredible as Remy. Like I think that's fantastic casting. The I yeah. Like I think Pixar has always done well. Everybody in the Incredibles, I think, is excellent. So look, Pixar, they've nailed the casting here. Um the Grasshoppers come in pretty early into the movie. They're very good at going these this is the stakes, yeah. The everything's being set up really, really fast.

SPEAKER_01

I feel like, and I I really did appreciate that this was pretty scary. I thought the grasshoppers were pretty pretty threatening. Kevin Spacey comes in, and that's before the allegations, so he's just a good characterization.

SPEAKER_00

I do love that both of them are so entwined that they've both got a cancelled celebrity in them.

SPEAKER_01

I love and our big one as well. Yeah, big sex pest, big freak. Really? And I feel like both of them are just like, will they be redeemed? No. But they tried. Both tried. Woody was just like, what if I what if I just did it? And everyone went, you can't make moves anymore. Not in America, at least. I can't suppose he's like, killed them all.

SPEAKER_00

I can't wait to show Bug's life to my kid and then be like, now that Grasshopper, we're gonna watch his YouTube videos from Christmas 20 years ago. Look at how weird this is, son.

SPEAKER_01

Why is he doing the accent? Well, it's context. No context. Yeah. That's just what he sounds like now. He grew grew into the voice, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Would you believe he's trying to make everybody uh make us think he we feel bad for him because he's now like just a piano player in premium hotels in Greece?

SPEAKER_01

I think it was Israel. I think he was playing it there.

SPEAKER_00

No, I was in Greece. Oh, he was in Greece. He was in Greece. Good for him. Everybody was like, these hotels are beautiful. Like, what do you fuck you? I don't know.

SPEAKER_01

Save your money. I don't want to support Kevin Spacey, but if I was at a Greek if I was in Athens and I was just at a shitty hotel and Kevin Spacey's on the piano, I'm not endorsing it, but I'll take a picture.

SPEAKER_00

I wouldn't.

SPEAKER_01

Oh wow. I think Mr. Brave over here.

SPEAKER_00

I I think it'd be one of those things where I'd be so interested in going up to because I mean, let's face it, he's a criminal. And so you'd go up to him and you'd I would he not that he would answer honestly, but I would love to ask people. What if he was just like what was it like? What was it actually like to be so horrifically on top of the world and and just fucking talk people?

SPEAKER_01

He'd be like, Carl, he's like, I know your name, I can censor it. Kevin's basic. It's like it was a rush like no other, and quite frankly, I want to get back to it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I think that's what's so sad is you can see these people like clawing water. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

But in this film, he's terrific, he's very spooky. Um, and I like in the kids' film that they're like, we're gonna scare these kids. Fuck it. Still got that 80s, 90s mentality, just like we don't care. Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Um, so something I thought was missing from a bug's life uh that I think Pixar really I think maybe Monsters Inc. was their first one that really nailed it. Oh, Monsters Inc. I forgot. That's a great one as well. Oh probably I don't know the timeline of next of I don't know the timeline of Pixar.

SPEAKER_01

So Toy Story 1, Bugs Life, Toy Story Two, and then you've got a Monsters Inc.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so I think obviously Toy Story 2 is the one where they figure out Heart. Yeah. Because then I think Monsters Inc. has a lot of heart, and then from that point on, until they get to Up, when they go, Oh, we can make them cry, and we'll try and do that every time. Yeah. But I think the sweet spot for Heart is like in between Toy Story 2 and Up. Yeah. Because I think there's a lot of Heart missing from this movie. Where I'm like, do I really care about Flick and the relationship to the princess? No, you don't.

SPEAKER_01

I think I think the the your driving force is sort of like, can these ants overtake the grasshoppers? Which is fine. Yeah. I think as a as a child, you're like, yeah, that's good.

SPEAKER_00

Getting us away from the colony is the smartest thing the movie does. I think going where our main leads are actually going to be the circus and flick, and they'll come back and help the colony. But like the amount of fucking characters from the colony and in ants, I was just doing my head in.

SPEAKER_01

It was, and you're just like, J Lo's here? I don't wanna be here.

SPEAKER_00

Essentially, we get it was nice watching a bug movie that wasn't like sexually driven, you know. I think that was what was weird about ants was they were like, isn't this a hot ant?

SPEAKER_01

Like, I don't wanna for some reason that like we did animatonical correct ants, just like, I don't know, guys, pick a lane, you know, make a sexy ant or make a right ant, you know. That's right, I'll say it's uh when I look at an ant, I look disgusted. Yeah, I'm not into that shit.

SPEAKER_00

It's look, I'm gonna say right off the bat, and look, I get a lot of people are into ants, not me. I don't think I couldn't deny. This guy's a big ant header. You're probably right. I'll give it another crack.

SPEAKER_01

Just putting your face in a colony of ants, like, you know what? Maybe I might just this is good. We should quickly just go through the plot. Essentially, flick fucks up the food, the grasshoppers come down and go, hey, not on you guys have got two days of like until the leaf came.

SPEAKER_00

He isn't an he is an inventor.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Which at the at the time, most animated movies had an inventor in them. Uh remember the Robinsons one. I do, right? Kind of hated that one.

SPEAKER_01

That is a pretty miserable one. I feel like the evil guy is the best part of that film, but that's just so much hard.

SPEAKER_00

He always rocks up at the horror nights in Disneyland. I love watching those videos that they're like, look, it's the bowler hat man.

SPEAKER_01

That's a big get, honestly. That's a big get. It's funny, iconically, I feel like that is that's the get, really.

SPEAKER_00

A weird slender figure with a mustache. He's just kind of memorable for that film. God, Clive Chance Meat Balls also.

SPEAKER_01

Kids love inventors. People love inventors. Yeah, it's a good pra tag. Um, but yeah, so pretty much Flick has to now go out and figure it out. And the colonel goes, go nuts, we don't care, you know?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that they don't expect him to come back. Uh he also really fucks them up in a way that, and this was sort of terrifying to me, is the grasshoppers say, hey, you've got to double the amount of food that you collect, and if not, I'm gonna come back and kill you all. Yeah. Um, I do struggle with the motives of the grasshoppers. So the grasshoppers, it turns out that's brother, that's probably the strongest part of the film.

SPEAKER_01

What are you not getting?

SPEAKER_00

Well, so they don't want to be overrun by the ants. Yes, but they don't wanna they don't want to work for food.

SPEAKER_01

They know that the ants could take over them. Yes. There are no there are no immediate danger from the ants, but they don't want to work for their food. So they're using them almost as the slave labor.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, okay. So the main thing is they don't want to because uh a part of me was like, I couldn't I mu probably looked away or wasn't paying attention, so it is my bad. But I thought it was the fact that he was mainly just scared about being overrun and the food was secondary. But I just feel like a there's a way for him to have uh handled the whole situation where he's fictitious the whole time without the ants overthrowing him.

SPEAKER_01

No, no, here's the thing he's abuse he's abusing his power, so he does not is a classic, is this like 1%, 99% sort of vibe. You know, he knows he could just get his food, that's fine. Yeah, but then he's scum getting his food. Why would you do that when you get the answer for you? But to do that, you need to use control and you need to use fear and manipulation so they can work.

SPEAKER_00

There's just not enough grasshoppers for him to get away with this.

SPEAKER_01

I feel like this literally this is the world right now.

SPEAKER_00

I know, I get, but it's just like the but here's the thing. What I'm saying is we're never gonna rise up.

SPEAKER_01

Speak for yourself, I went out and bought a gun. I just thought, fuck it, you know. And I gotta tell you, guys, I'm in the 1%. I stole a buttload of money as well.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I would love to see a billionaire fed to fed to the birds. I just feel like we're doing a live feeding with a bunch of crows, be like, all right.

SPEAKER_01

I think, you know, I think a lot of people would gum out for that. I feel like at the at the vibe at the moment, yeah, go nuts, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Um, okay, so let's talk about the circus. So we get introduced to our cast of characters. Who's your favourite here? Favourite, least favourite.

SPEAKER_01

Okay, oh, I you know, I I gotta tell you, I love Stick. Yeah, I loved Stick. Stick's really fun. I think he's got a fun voice actor. I'm not sure who it is. Oh, sorry, it's the guy from Fraser who plays uh Sideshow Bob's brother. Cecil, I can't remember his name, but he's uh he's Fraser's.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, isn't it um I've never seen Fraser?

SPEAKER_01

David Hyde Pierce. Maybe, yes, yes, yes, yes. He plays him. That's great guys. He's very good as well. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

You know, he didn't come back for the reboot, and that was a good call by him.

SPEAKER_01

Okay, well, I thought you could if we got my hopes up. So maybe we don't, maybe we fucking my expectations.

SPEAKER_00

Pixar's constantly coming up with reasons to not make a bug slide.

SPEAKER_01

Uh being like, it just isn't gonna work. But yes, no, stick's probably my hat. Um I'm loving it. Loving the ladybug. Yeah. Um, I'm loving these little uh the the the little the Russian bugs. Yeah. I would say probably Grasshopper or probably uh spider, probably.

SPEAKER_00

There's drum spider. Now drum spider's good. Yes, but they're out of the film, right? I feel it's at the beginning and then at the end.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I think they were like, okay, the circus actually has to be run by a crew. They did not get but reggae spider, the two light bugs, yeah, and there's another one. I think it's the two millipedes who run the stuff. They're also my favorite. They get no lines, but they've got good vibes. Would put would love to hang with them. I feel like, you know, I'm working the circus, I step out, these guys are smoking behind the corner. I'm like, hey guys, what's your vibe? Yeah, they're sick.

SPEAKER_00

So they do nail how out of touch the circus is. I think that there's a really great they nail, they nail that. I thought they I didn't know that need to be depicted in a film. I thought it really well because look, I've seen I've seen Madagascar 3. I think it's a little bit too pro-circus, if you ask me. I think a butt's life is on top of it. I think it's a mess.

SPEAKER_01

I don't think you're saying even like the animal cruelty. I think you're just like the vibe of a circus, not for me.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, no, I think that there's a part where a fly leaves with two kids and she goes, I've seen piles of shit better than that. And I went, That's a great read.

SPEAKER_01

That's a great read. One flies like and I got I got I was la I was la I was having a hoot. One life flies like I live for 24 hours, I'm not wasting on this.

SPEAKER_00

That's good stuff. I think my I only got one, I got one laugh out of the movie. Oh yeah. Um and that was when the stick got lost in all the sticks. That was that was a really good that was a really good bit. I was like, that's that's the shit I need. I was if that joke was in ants, ants is a full recommend. Five out of five, but it's not. But it's not. It's a four and a half, it's a four and a half. It's a simple four and a half, and it is very good. It is a very good film.

SPEAKER_01

Um who are you loving bugwise?

SPEAKER_00

I loved look, I love Stick and I love the ladybug. I didn't I didn't love um the the German caterpillar as much as I thought I would. I think vibe was him as from the ending of Toy Story 2. Yes, that's I think I've realized that's where it's at for now.

SPEAKER_01

I also didn't think he had much going on for him, you know.

SPEAKER_00

I was he was just fat and jolly. And I think we've gotten past that. We have.

SPEAKER_01

As a society, we're not looking for that anymore.

SPEAKER_00

I'm not looking for that in a caterpillar.

SPEAKER_01

It's definitely a fun, dated film. There's certain little like little things like, oh, yeah. Yeah, that's fun. Absolutely. Yeah. I think one of them goes, Well, I'm gonna commit suicide. And I went, Jesus Christ. Could you imagine just like in turning red, just like, oh my god, I'm gonna blow my brains out. You're like, it just shouldn't work.

SPEAKER_00

I also like too that I think uh um Pixar does a really good job at uh just establishing scenes with like a side character's life really quickly and moving on. Like I think in finding Nemo with the two pelicans is always like really good. Um but I really liked in this one with the two flies going towards the light, like just as being that's the introduction to the big city. Yeah. I think in ants, they never would really cut away to much else that was happening on in the world of ants. It made ants feel like a very small movie.

SPEAKER_01

Which is funny because they're ants. Yeah, which is funny because they're ants.

SPEAKER_00

Whereas I think a bug's life does feel like it's a thriving there's more past the colony. If I'm comparing the two movies, yeah, totally feels like there's a way vast world in it in a bug's life.

SPEAKER_01

And I feel like it almost stimulates your imagination. I feel like that's what Pixar does quite well of just being like, if I saw a bunch of bugs, I'm like, wow, I can understand this. Whereas if I'm looking at after watching ants, you know, I'm not going, I wonder who's in therapy right now. I wonder who's made some like beautiful 70s films and then done some horrible little things, you know. Which ants are which ants are monster, you know? But um, yeah, no, and a really creative way to just establish a scene. I feel like ants has none of that really.

SPEAKER_00

No, ants was ants was very bad at what it was. But it was very good. But it was very bad. Very good. Very good. Um once we get to the big city, uh, I do find it funny that both movies wanted to depict a bar. They were like, we want to see how ants ants drink.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I think such a common thing of just like, well, they're getting fucked up. Yeah, you know, they're they're they're ants. Yeah, they're workers, so they're probably fucked up right now. I bro I mean, what are you thinking bar-wise? Now, I feel like although I really like the green triangles and ants, I gotta tell you, would love to chew on a seed from this world.

SPEAKER_00

I look, I thought the seed looks nice. I gotta tell you, the blo the the blood. Oh my god, right. That seemed like it got him an absolute rush. That looked like crack cocaine. It looked like he had a nang. Yeah. That's what it looked like he had. I was like, whoa, Pixar knows what's up.

SPEAKER_01

He definitely didn't, he definitely said type A, but then I'm not thinking like, did he say hepatitis? He's just like, fuck it up. It looked like he got something where it was it was good. Brother, I've got HIV and I'd love to know where it was sourced. It looked delicious. The berries look great.

SPEAKER_00

I think just very I mean, honestly, the everything looked tasty, and you know why it looked tasty in comparison to ants? Colour.

SPEAKER_01

This movie uses a lot of colour. They're constantly like, we've got to throw a berry in here because they we're in a seedy tin can, and it still has more colour than like what are the tables of Coca-Cola Coca-Cola bottles.

SPEAKER_00

Everything's just somebody's gotten somebody's had some sense of imagination. Yeah. In ants, it was always what are they on? A mound. Everything's a mound.

SPEAKER_01

And you know what? I feel like it's a bit more in G I feel like in ants they just had like pickaxes. At least they're like, we've rolled a leaf up, and that's his backpack, you know, and a seeds, a tin can, you know?

SPEAKER_00

If I could give a compliment to ants, I do appreciate that ants had a real threat to what was going on. That's what was a threat. Well, just feel like ants could die at any time. Like lots of ants would be. I'm just saying I'm not on edge. And I was on edge during ants.

SPEAKER_01

Surely when when Hopper arrives, you're on edge. You know, I'm liking this world where it's a bit more kinder to the ants. But I will give you that.

SPEAKER_00

That's not what life's like. And that's and that's that's not what life is like.

SPEAKER_01

And that's why ants has a higher Metacritic score because it's gritty. And it's very good. It gets down if that's the thing it's very good. And that's the thing, it's very good. But here's the thing it is just it is just, you know, am I gonna uh poo-poo the film because a sticky insect and an ant are hanging out? Probably they're enemies, you know. I imagine race wars happen quite a lot.

SPEAKER_00

I agree, we should call the film out for that.

SPEAKER_01

A bug's life is lazy and it's not to nature's qualities. No, no, no. And that's what a lot of the critics were saying in '98. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

They were saying that all the time. Yeah. And they were right too. They were right to bring it up, they'll write to bring the hammer down.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's nice in Monsters Inc. They kind of addressed those allegations. Um and didn't hire any pedophiles. Uh, which was nice. They were great at doing that. I'm pretty sure Mike no, yeah, running through.

SPEAKER_00

I feel like Pixar doesn't have apart from Kevin, they haven't really checked.

SPEAKER_01

They've definitely. I believe Wally was a freak, you know, whoever the little robot that got a little spin-off. I think he was a monster.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. I heard that too for the great part.

SPEAKER_01

Oh wait, no, what's about Pixar? Isn't like the main guy who did it? Like, didn't he get cancelled?

SPEAKER_00

Oh yeah, he got cancelled, but he's not he's not a voice actor in anything. Um they bring the circus back.

SPEAKER_01

What's this cliche called? Is it just the liar found out? Like it's like it's just one of those.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah, it's just uh there's a lie that's established and they're all gonna get found out. Yeah. Um man, I I've I think another thing too is as a kid hated it.

SPEAKER_01

I always hate it. Always hated it. I always again agree. As a kid, you're just like this. I remember like, just tell the truth. All I've been told as a kid is tell the truth, and maybe the film's running that through my mind, and I'm always telling the truth, but I'm pissed off because I'm wasting my time.

SPEAKER_00

I know. I just thought I was like, it's always gonna come out. Stop lying. Stop lying. Um, and I mean, look, a great lesson for each other.

SPEAKER_01

Look, and that's the thing, and that's you know, we're all about film should teach you a lesson or change your life or be ants.

SPEAKER_00

I think as a kid though, because I did as a kid I was a big liar, so I guess when I watched it as well, I was like, I would have gotten away with that.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, flick would a fool. Yeah, yeah. It was funny too. Oh, he's a better lie.

SPEAKER_00

Because while they while they go through lying, um, in the end, they also try to lie to the grasshopper. So it was anything. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a lot about lying.

SPEAKER_01

Sometimes you should lie to your enemy, but to your friends.

SPEAKER_00

Friends, no, never lie to your colony, lie to your enemy. It's what they had written down as their big motto for the film, big message for the kids.

SPEAKER_01

You gotta teach them something, you know. You gotta teach them something. These circus freaks come back. They're like, hell yeah, we can't wait to be at the circus. Immediately the answer, like, so you guys are gonna go kill us, grasshoppers, right? They're like, oh, we don't want to do that. But then they get praise. I do like the circus freaks, um, only motivation is uh praise.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it felt like they actually had a circus consultant on the film come in and say, Oh no, it's that's all we want. Yeah. I've never met a clown doing it for fun. You know, they want the praise.

SPEAKER_01

The praise and the highs of a laugh, you wouldn't believe. Yeah, and that's most comedians, you know, that's most trapeze artists, that's most uh ring bearers. They're really in it for just the the the fleeting high of and they put giant shoes on for the love of it.

SPEAKER_00

They want the praise. That's pretty much their crack.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

That's their crack. I also couldn't believe that this circus, three clowns. Three clowns at this circus. That's a lot of clowns. That's a lot of clowns, but can I say too many clowns?

SPEAKER_01

Have you ever seen a circus of one clown? It's like a rodeo, it's like it's it's like ironically, like a rodeo. You don't want too many people for a rodeo, but you want three clowns for that.

SPEAKER_00

But when the when the when the circus is eight people, it's it's to have nearly 50% be clowns.

SPEAKER_01

That's clear that's a circus, buddy. What circus you go into that's meaning trapeze, get out of here. The circus delay? Okay, well that they nailed it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

The most six the one that's still running worldwide. I'm pretty sure they've only got like they've got three clowns, like 45 trapeze.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, they're all flipping and shit. But you know, back in '98, you could just you were mainly clown.

SPEAKER_00

Back in '98, they knew the circus was it was running out of time.

SPEAKER_01

Wasn't it crazy? They were just like, maybe we should hire fire these fools. And maybe the people that are actually talented should be uh front and center. I mean, let's let's let's kill the lion guy who's been torturing that line.

SPEAKER_00

Kill the lion guy and the lion. Yeah. Let's just get that done with.

SPEAKER_01

But but the string stuff, I feel like that could work, and it did.

SPEAKER_00

It really did. They were like, what if we what if we did plots without dialogue?

SPEAKER_01

Guys, use the promo code wwwt to get uh 20% off of your your uh experience. It only works for the Vegas shows, though.

SPEAKER_00

We have a big Vegas demo.

SPEAKER_01

So if you're there, yeah, check out go up to the booth and go, hey, the who would watch this boy send me. And they're like, oh shit, front row.

SPEAKER_00

The two Aussie lads said told me to come here. They'll go, ah, yeah, you're down the front, you're in the splash zone.

SPEAKER_01

The last clown just jizzes on you. Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_00

It's a great scenario we got. You you're one of the first 80 people to take us up on this new exciting promo with the Who Would Watch This Boys for Oz.

SPEAKER_01

And here's the thing, it's made them a lot of money. And dare I say I do.

SPEAKER_00

It's made them a fuck ton of money. That's why I'm pro-circus.

SPEAKER_01

I'm pro-ands and pro circus. Those are my standings.

SPEAKER_00

Every time a new circus sole gets pitched, they're like, if we it can be greenlit, the investors are in if the who would watch this boys are.

SPEAKER_01

Perform for me. They fly them all out here to put to perform for us in this very room. Look, most of the shows are pretty cramped, but when they really when they spread their wings, wow.

SPEAKER_00

The fact that they work out how to flip in this fucking broom closet that we record in, that in itself is that that's impressive. Um They get attacked by a bird. They get attacked by a bird. A lot of the movie revolves around luck and perspective. So everyone's That's life, baby.

SPEAKER_01

You know, and that's and that's a bug, and that's a life. That's a bug's life.

SPEAKER_00

Um the they should they should have called the film that um they get attacked by a bird. Every look, every time somebody views the perspective of the circus in the wrong way, it always just legitimizes everyone. It just kept happening the whole film. I was like, I was getting a bit sick of it, if I'm being honest. Um but we got this big bird attack, it's important to the plot. Um and that makes everybody really brave. It makes them legitimizes everyone, everyone's really happy with them. Everyone's like, wow, these guys can get away with it. Inspires the whole colony to branch out.

SPEAKER_01

Well, then they're like, you know what? I feel like the circus people pro can't kill them. Why don't we make a bird? Yeah. Um, I gotta tell you, the bird making scene, loved it. When they bit into a leaf and then brought it up and then made a shadow of that. Wow. I thought that was a genius.

SPEAKER_00

Interesting. I was kind of bored. I was not. Yeah. I think by I think around this time, no, no, I checked out. You checked out the bird making scene? I think once the bird attacks happened, I thought the movie started to started to plateau.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, look, you we've burned through 45 minutes, and now we've got the bird making scene, the circus. Fighting out scene and then the bird action sequence.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I just thought it was, I think the I think the movie was was riding okay. And I and I think it it sort of started to peter out. The I think Pixar as well got better at um, this is obviously early in their career, but I think Pixar got a lot better at Show Don't Tell. I think this one it was a lot of, you know, the princess gets introduced and she's like, I'm nervous, I'm a nervous person, I'm a nervous bug, I'm just one of those nervous bugs that's in charge. Like, oh okay.

SPEAKER_01

I I guys tell you they've I I think they stopped doing like the plots, the love thing. I think maybe Michael's outsky for comedy gets like a love interest. Yeah. But um, I hate this love interest. I don't think flicking her work at all. I just I just wouldn't ship them. I wouldn't ship them.

SPEAKER_00

And look, I know I brought it up about ants, but I am sorry to say they've got no sexual chemistry.

SPEAKER_01

Look, Woody and um I think Jennifer Lopez, who would usually work, would usually work on paper and photograph the book. I would love that if they filmed it like Rango and they were all on set and then Roddy Allen was just like I believe Jennifer Lopez insisted.

SPEAKER_00

She said, I'm only doing this if Woody's in the booth with me.

SPEAKER_01

I wanna, I wanna, I, you know, I can't act. I'm a method person, so I need to be in love. I need to see my my prey.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I believe she rocked up and they were like, we're just doing the booth, and she was like, I was told we were doing this like a Zamekas Christmas Carol stitch.

SPEAKER_01

I got told we were doing this like a Manhattan situation. I thought I was filming in New York and I thought it was gonna be in a Woody Allen film. Imagine being like you want to be in a Woody Allen film?

SPEAKER_00

Woody Allen's ass. She was like, get me the lead. Get me the fucking lead right now.

SPEAKER_01

But yeah, no, we get the bird making scene. Yeah. They're they're praised.

SPEAKER_00

Um, and then I think we can fast forward to when the lie comes out. Yeah. Um The Lie comes out in a in just a I think in a I think I didn't like when the lie came out either. It was a lot of like, well, Flick said he could get away with it. And everyone's like, no, you flick and you lie. I'm like, ah, I prefer when the lie comes out in a more organic way.

SPEAKER_01

It's janky, the the the the the circus uh wranglers like, hey, there were circus freaks. Uh but at this point they have a big bird. So I don't really and they've also seen them be brave.

SPEAKER_00

They don't go ahead with the lie. Yeah. It's weird that the Queen was like, we're just going to well, let's just put our heads together and die.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. That's just there was you've seen them be brave. You'd be like, okay, so you're circus freaks. That's bad, but we've already got a bird, and you guys seem like you're pretty good. Devin, you've done already all the work of the plan. What's wrong? And you knew you'd own enough food. Yeah. So just like this is better than what you had.

SPEAKER_00

She's a weak character and she's right to give up the crown at the end. Yeah. You know who's brave? That little kid bug.

SPEAKER_01

Love uh dot.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so I didn't love Dot, but I didn't think she was brave. Yeah. I thought she was a frustrating character. You didn't like dots? I feel like Dot had a lot. She had to learn to fly. I didn't care. She had she was she was she was a frustrating character. It was one of those ones where I was like, just learn, just get on with it.

SPEAKER_01

Here's the thing, it's one of those films where you actually it's that's the point. You know, you actually need to be uh restricted.

SPEAKER_00

It was good to be annoyed. Yeah, exactly. But Bugs Life was like, it's good to be annoyed right now. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01

That's that's that's what kind of film we're dealing with.

SPEAKER_00

The only time I liked her, that that hidey hole, that cave.

SPEAKER_01

Pretty good.

SPEAKER_00

That was sick.

SPEAKER_01

They're in the stem of a l of a plant. That was unreal slide down it and it's a little hole. Love the look of the whole thing.

SPEAKER_00

That was cooler than any moment in ants. Yeah. That was unreal. I love that when they were like hide in here, I went, they they'll never find you in there. No. That was I blew my mind.

SPEAKER_01

If I was a bug, last place had looked.

SPEAKER_00

I'm shocked they don't just live in there all the time. Because if they had done that to every single piece of grass and they're just hidden every time the grasshoppers come. Pretty good. Should have just done that. Yeah. Did they ever consider hiding? I guess I guess they I guess they did. Oh, they don't move. It was the same thing with ants. I was like, guys, just move.

SPEAKER_01

Well, you get you got your whole thing set up. It's all it seemed like it was a lot. A million of them in the caves. Just move. Uh you or you didn't see the ants. I think there's only a hundred, you know. Also not enough. Also, straight up, you have a home. Why would you move? Just because just something happened. Because the grasshopper came up. Somebody was bothering me.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, or somebody kept breaking in and being like, oh, I've eaten all your food. Get me more food. Try and earn more income. I'd be like, I'm gonna go. Just just foreclosed.

SPEAKER_01

I'm fine. I'll find I'll find something else. I can go steal. Camp out, I'll camp. Happen to go anywhere you're not. That's fine. It's crazy how easy it would be to steal your home, it seems.

SPEAKER_00

Yes. Oh, very easy. I'm willing to give mine over to squatters ASAP like that in a click.

SPEAKER_01

But yeah, no. So this whole the the the circus freaks leave. Yeah. And then the grasshoppers come back and be like, what the fuck's going on right here? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Look, it's funny we also get a climax with water, like in ants. Yeah. Um, but the ants realize, oh I don't know, there's a big bird scene. I did like the fact that um the ringleader comes back and uses the flame. Yes. Um, and that's what I thought when I was like, oh, this is the good effortless Pixar stuff where they've set up things at the beginning of the movie, you weren't expecting them to go back to the back.

SPEAKER_01

It feels effortless, doesn't it? You're just like, I wasn't expecting him to expect this burning bit to come back.

SPEAKER_00

It's when they set up stuff at the beginning and it doesn't feel like it's important, you know, because that that is what sets the all the characters on their trajectory, so it's just great when it comes to doing it at the end.

SPEAKER_01

I always think, and it's such an easy writing tool of just if you have exposition or something that needs to come back, just use it in a in a comedy or just use it as a joke. Yeah. Because everyone's always off guard, can't you?

SPEAKER_00

Yes, that's right. You and you go, well, that's just fun. You've done that for fun, yes, not for playoff. Yeah. Uh so I thought that was fantastic. Look, I think the climax is fun. I think this is where the villain said he's scariest. Totally. I do like the idea of being squished. I thought that was kind of threatening. Yeah. Um, but again, I think ants just had a better, better understanding of violence in a bug world.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, a bunch of people got decapitated a la Vietnam, you know, sort of vibes. It was really powerful. So yeah. It was really powerful. I don't know if I could praise ants for just going full hog on essentially war crimes.

SPEAKER_00

I can. Okay, praise it. Because it's very good. It's very good. Um critical darling.

SPEAKER_01

I love you just being sort of a coward like critic. Just like the Metacritic is pretty high. I guess I'll just it's pretty good. It's very good. It's not for me. It's very good though. I've said about summing up a film just like 90%. Look, I like it. It's just not.

SPEAKER_00

It's not for me, but I can acknowledge it's very good.

SPEAKER_01

God, the cinematography is great.

SPEAKER_00

It's unreal. All of the acting is absolutely unreal. The writing, flawless. You can't fault anything in the film. In the movie, and it's not for me. It's just not for me, but I can acknowledge it's very good.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, look, this bird is f uh flown out. It's burnt. Hoppa's like, what the fuck?

SPEAKER_00

I think the nighttime sequences with the with the fire, I thought, oh wow, they are really flexing what they can do with lighting in 1998 in a fully animated fashion.

SPEAKER_01

They are, and I think it I think there's there's certain bits you go, oh, that's right, you guys couldn't be done. Yeah, and you know, even the water sequences, I'm like, looks a bit janky.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, look, I think the rain falling isn't the best. Um funny they've all got this uh the funny both movies were like to an ant, like a little puddle of a droplet.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's a whole that's like their food. Yeah, that's how it is.

SPEAKER_00

They can get stuck in it for a while if they're not.

SPEAKER_01

It happens quite often, isn't it? It's how many bits get played. And again, they are just cheating off each other. You know, they did take all of the.

SPEAKER_00

You wonder how ants really survive uh sorry, ants really survive in a world like this, you know?

SPEAKER_01

It's tough, you know. It's really tough. They're really low. Especially when grasshoppers are oppressing them. Not um.

SPEAKER_00

I did appreciate that they didn't depict any people. I think that that was a good difference between ants and a bug's life.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, just to say we're not gonna have and ants is janky because they kind of half do it, they're like, whatever foot was it? I'm like, okay.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I get why ants goes we don't want to show the people to an ant this is a really big existential threat. I get that.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, but I don't think it's even used as that way. It's almost just like a uh I think they wanted it for the trailer, ants getting stepped on. That's classic stuff.

SPEAKER_00

I mean that's but that's the life of an ant. You know, that's what's very good about ants, is the element the life of an ant. It depicts the life of another.

SPEAKER_01

Whereas this is just some sort of honky tonky shitty story. I just don't know if it would be a thing.

SPEAKER_00

Look, if you put both movies up side by side, what's more educational? Ants. What's what's a dream fantasy world that's fun and more enjoyable? A bug's life.

SPEAKER_01

I love you using just like, look, it's it's it's more of like a shower compared to like a shinless lips. I fully agree. Yeah, you know? Ants is more of a nine-hour documentary on the uh that's real. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00

A bug's life is fun.

SPEAKER_01

It's cartoonish.

SPEAKER_00

It's very plus to the beautiful steak dinner that is ants. It's giving you, it's giving you what the life of a bug is. That's what the difference between the two are.

SPEAKER_01

All I can just imagine is the camera panning down to Jennifer Lopez's ant legs and being like, and be like, look, it's good. That's what it must be like to be an ant though.

SPEAKER_00

I think the titles should swap because I feel like Noah.

SPEAKER_01

You're not getting the font. You're not getting the font. Because quite frankly, if you give them the font, it's a hundred percent of mixed up.

SPEAKER_00

Citizen King couldn't do it. Um yep, so we've got that big climax where I will say though, when they do when they have the monologue, not that the monologue had anything on me.

SPEAKER_01

When um the monologue was pretty f stunning, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Look, I didn't think anything of the monologue, but the big reveal of all of the ants being like putting all their elbows together and gearing up, it gave me chills, and it's giving me chills now.

SPEAKER_01

God, and that's teamwork. That was really that was very strong. And that's the message of the movie, you know, guys. Isn't that great, you know?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, um, they are absolutely able to over crazy they just become friends with the grasshoppers. The only issue with the grasshoppers was just the leader. One bad apple. It's just one bad apple, that's all it is.

SPEAKER_01

And then that feral one. The feral one, and you didn't see the bloopers, but he has a great little monologue where he's actually he's almost like a Daniel Day Lewis. He's a method. I could tell.

SPEAKER_00

I could tell without knowing the bloopers that that character is. He was a very good actor.

SPEAKER_01

He was a very good actor, yes. No, uh Hopper is taken by the bird, and in one of the most I love this sequence because this is horrifying. He's screaming for his life, he wants to not die, and he is fed alive to the birds. And where's the tooth? Where where where's Pixar now? You know, you never see Russell and up getting devoured by birds. I just think that that lacks a lot, you know. You know, is turning red ever gonna have them, you know, being shotgunned in the face? I just don't think that's really what's I've never seen turning red. I think that that would be a sequence that would work for. You're right.

SPEAKER_00

Turning red's about gun violence, and you wouldn't know it from the trailer, but it is.

SPEAKER_01

No, Elemental should have that. I feel like they should snuff out the flame, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Well they do, don't they? Isn't that a thing in the movie?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I remember I can't remember. There's a magical flame that was better than all the others. I can't remember.

SPEAKER_00

It says it's it's it didn't leave a big impact on me. It wasn't big for me.

SPEAKER_01

Um but it is a okay film.

SPEAKER_00

It's fine. It's fine. It's fine for that. Critics said pretty good. It's fine. Yeah. Everyone said elemental is fine. I'm getting to watch Hoppers. People seem to love Hoppers. Yeah, me too. Um the end of the movie. Everything sort of comes together for them. The villain is defeated, they live life as is. The circus goes away, which I'd forgotten. I forgot the circus left them at the end. Um So if they were to come back, everyone would be dead, wouldn't they? Well that means that's the life cycle of uh how long does an ant live?

SPEAKER_01

Now I was confused because I remember an ant they said the queen could last 30 years. Couldn't tell you what the lifespan of an average ant is. Um but you look, you're right, but isn't that everything, you know? You can say about any movie, you know, if you came out in a field of dreams, half the cast gonna be dead.

SPEAKER_00

Well they're a ghost, so.

SPEAKER_01

Okay, well, bad movie, alright. Shawshang Redemption Trek.

SPEAKER_00

Um You keep on naming Blade Runner?

SPEAKER_01

No, that's the future. They'd be still be there. Yeah. They'd be still kicking.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I guess I'm right. Yeah, I guess you yeah, I guess you know. You tried to poke three holes and it couldn't it couldn't be done.

SPEAKER_01

It's a seamless it's a water balloon that just can't be penetrated.

SPEAKER_00

What did you think of the of the caterpillar's wings?

SPEAKER_01

Pretty pretty magnificent. Did you laugh? I I fucking screamed with with humour. You wouldn't believe the noises that are coming out of my mouth when he had his wings. Like it was it was feral. It was feral. Girl! Who would watch a bug's life? And which one's better?

SPEAKER_00

Uh okay, so I think this is a this is a double-edged sword here. Because in the end, uh I've decided neither are good. Um neither are for me. I didn't like either of them. Um I think a bug's life is the better one of the two. I think it's got more joyous moments. It's a much more palatable watch. Uh though I I think the well, I think, I think there's no ultimate bug movie yet. Crazy were in the year 2026. Yeah, not me. 2023 is where I'm at. I'm three years behind. What's the ultimate bug movie? People would say bugs life, and I'm saying it hasn't been made yet.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, look, I'd give you that. Because you've also got uh you've also got uh, I guess Arthur and the Invisibles. Bad. Bad. You got Ant Bully, which is not very good. Um, you got any got any crazy?

SPEAKER_00

It's just not a good medium. Not good plots are set. Which is funny. I like Fern Gully, but I feel like that's not That's more of forests. That's more forest or fairies.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's more the imaginary things. And in that case, you you can run wild. Yeah, leprechauns are in that.

SPEAKER_00

So it just it hasn't been done. And so, guys, the playing field is open for anyone to come and grab this this plot. Yeah, look, do something like that.

SPEAKER_01

Bugs life zero, your own invention, maybe a possible one.

SPEAKER_00

I think the and the common denominator here is why on it why is an ant the lead of both? One of the least compelling parts of the bug world to me are ants. Give me something interesting.

SPEAKER_01

Sorry, no, it's it's B movie. That's the best bug movie.

SPEAKER_00

Bad as well.

SPEAKER_01

Like it's just get out of here. Get out of here. That's probably you know what's actually great that probably is the highest. That's probably the one that's the most B movie. That's good.

SPEAKER_00

But is it is it really a bug movie, or is that really just like there's there's there's there's bumblebees and they're flying around saying that. It was a big well in the 90s. Uh so yeah, look, who who would watch this? Anyone that has to toss up between the two, this is the one to watch. Yeah, but no, neither are gonna satisfy you. Neither, and if you want a realistic one, ants.

SPEAKER_01

If you want one that's more like ants, if you want to like a rich, complex, sort of like just really getting the nitty-gritty of being an ant, it is ants with a Zed.

SPEAKER_00

If you took both movies and you showed it to an actual ant, they would say, My life is more like ants. And so isn't that one maybe the better one?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, look, I'm all we're all about representation here, and quite frankly, the ant world slash colony has yet to really be depicted through the POV of the ant, you know, and I just think you know, maybe guys, maybe open your ears, open your mind, and uh and maybe stretch out your antennae. Yeah, because you know it's it's it's their POV. And quite frankly, how are you gonna enrich your own life if you're willing to close your eyes, you know, or close your uh mantibles like ants. I agree. Yeah I fully agree. Yeah. So who would who won? I think you know, not the audience, because no one's really been informed.

SPEAKER_00

Where are you sitting? What's your favorite of the two?

SPEAKER_01

Oh, it's ants. Sorry. And we're done. And we're done. It's just a very good movie. It's a very good movie. And that's the issue, you know. That is the issue.

SPEAKER_00

It's hard to come up against something that is unfathomably good.

SPEAKER_01

It's good. It's it's just it's just it's nice to see the same movie I've just watched uh a week ago that they spent, I want to say, one year on opposed to four. Yes. And it's just nice to see what a rushed uh production can do for you, you know? Yeah. It's good. Isn't it crazy they invented they just were like, we need computer science now, and they were like, it's we've made ants.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I guess they'd done like Jurassic Park and stuff, right? So they were But who gives a shit about that?

SPEAKER_01

You know, like really, really. Woody Allen's been depicted as an ant.

SPEAKER_00

Do you think Woody Allen's the height of it's the height I mean, is this up in Woody Allen's house? Yes. Did he ever forgive Pixar? No. No.

SPEAKER_01

Did he ever get another go at it? No, I don't think so.

SPEAKER_00

Nor does anyone care or want him to.

SPEAKER_01

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. I've not heard anything in the last 40 years, so I assume he should be in every voice acting role. Uh funny, I don't think the Simpsons actually uses him. I think they're doing a a a crude uh mocking of him, but I love he does a lot of um ads in Japan in that Simpsons episode. He's just weak.

SPEAKER_00

He yeah. The other thing I'd say is it's nice to have a movie where the protagonist is not just annoying.

SPEAKER_01

Just which one's annoying?

SPEAKER_00

The oh, I think like Flick is way better than Z. Yeah. Like the Flick was like, I'm just gonna get on with my adventure and do what needs to be done. Z didn't shut up. Z didn't have the bravery that needed to be done. No. Z sucked. Um, but it's very good.

SPEAKER_01

96% on Rotten Tomatoes. You really can't argue with that. It's very good. It's crazy, these are the two best films that we've reviewed in the podcast, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, they're some of the highest ever. Um, and the I wouldn't put them high with other things, you know. I still think even though these are the highest like on uh on the podcast we've done, you've still got to try and take down Unfriended 2 and Law Abiding Citizen. You just you've got to try and take them down.

SPEAKER_01

Here's the thing. I think that's the telling thing. No one has gone back, and even as a Pixar film, yeah, people aren't re-watching this, which is you know, I'm telling. Except some people in my letterbox are like five stars.

SPEAKER_00

A lot of people there's nostalgia, clouding this for sure. Pixar definitely got way better. There's nobody I if somebody's saying the best Toy Story film is the first one, they are lying.

SPEAKER_01

I probably say the second.

SPEAKER_00

Like who's gonna say the first who's going back and watching the? I think the first is tough to watch with the animation startups.

SPEAKER_01

Oh no, they updated it every like they updated it every like three years.

SPEAKER_00

I think it's I've tried to. I don't think I don't I think it's tough to watch. There's so broad, like the lack of detail, it feels so like just sort of cubes walking around.

SPEAKER_01

I don't know which version you've seen. They were updating that like they update that like every couple of years now. You reckon? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know what they've got on Disney Plus, but I remember. You should check after this. Because if they have, I'd love to go back. It looks great. They're constantly updating it, guys. Check out Toy Story, you know, it's the new hit film, you know. You know, they're not putting a bug's life in their parks. No, no. I think maybe that he that caterpillar might get probably is that the only sort of ri I completely forgot about the butterfly. There's a lot of the grasshopper as well. There's too many. There's too many. There's too many of them. Yeah, they narrow down.

SPEAKER_00

Nobody, nobody cares. Yeah. You can't meet any of these characters in a nobody's walking up to be like, I want to I want to meet and greet with Flick.

SPEAKER_01

I think you would actually.

SPEAKER_00

I think Flick would get a bit of a You would do it as a gag, but nobody's gonna actually do it. There's no seven-year-old kid being like, get me with Flick!

SPEAKER_01

I think Flick's are not the funniest character.

SPEAKER_00

I think maybe Flick's the realistic one they would make, though. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

They're not gonna I feel like Richard Kine's character was called like Wilt or something, which I thought was.

SPEAKER_00

I did appreciate that Richard Kine's like grasshopper looked like Richard Kine. They gave him sort of his humpin'. They really nailed it, huh? Yeah. God. Oscar, what are we reviewing next week? Carl, it's we love verses.

SPEAKER_01

And we're doing verses month, maybe a little bit longer. So guess what?

SPEAKER_00

It's gonna be two months at this rate, right?

SPEAKER_01

We're not gonna stop. This is what the podcast is now, actually. We're never gonna do it. Uh we've got Freddie versus Jason up against Alien vs Predator. It's Freddie. And no, I'm not talking Z vs. Alien. Just a little joke there. Kevin Spacey versus uh Woody. I guess that's really what we were watching. Uh but yeah, if you have any suggestions, please ask wwwt podcast at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, if you send in an email, it'll probably get to us.

SPEAKER_01

If not.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you know. Sometimes we miss them. Sometimes we miss them. No, no, we don't. Or do we?

SPEAKER_01

Kind of kind of thank you.

SPEAKER_00

You're playing us out? Yeah, yeah. Okay, keep going. It's gonna be great in an audio video. It's really gonna land.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you, thank you.